Submission for another skill change: "None Shall Pass!"

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Submission for another skill change: "None Shall Pass!"

Post by SAL on Thu Dec 10, 2009 11:54 pm

I decided to officially submit another skill change to wiki. This time it involves a long running thought in my head about Warriors. Please feel free to tell me what you think of it. I'm also listing my Shadow Form change here again, just in case anyone missed that and wants to read and/or comment on that too. I notice that it seems like the forum doesn't like the web address of the "None Shall Pass!" link, so I'm listing the address separately. If you have trouble with it, please just copy and paste it into your web browser, rather than clicking on it.

"None Shall Pass!"
Link: None Shall Pass
Address: "http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Feedback:User/SAL/"None_Shall_Pass!"_PvE_change" (remove quotes)

Shadow Form <--click

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Re: Submission for another skill change: "None Shall Pass!"

Post by Guest on Fri Dec 11, 2009 1:37 am

I like it a lot. Smile Would make tanking into a dream (or instant death).

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Re: Submission for another skill change: "None Shall Pass!"

Post by Guest on Fri Dec 11, 2009 1:59 am

It's an interesting change, but maybe 5sec recharge is a bit short ?

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Re: Submission for another skill change: "None Shall Pass!"

Post by Guest on Fri Dec 11, 2009 7:38 am

Kamisama wrote:It's an interesting change, but maybe 5sec recharge is a bit short ?

5 sec recharge until you can begin to make the 8 adrenaline needed to activate it, which can take anywhere from zero to umpteen seconds.

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Re: Submission for another skill change: "None Shall Pass!"

Post by Guest on Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:15 am

i like how tanking is hard in gw due to no instant threat abilities... that skill would simplify it a bit too much for my tastes, almost turning it into a different game.

in most games the concept of tanking feels just like you're exploiting a badly done ai. if you're bodyblocking the mobs or are much easier to reach i can see why they're punching on the high-defense, low-offense character, but direct threat manipulation goes over the line for me.

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Re: Submission for another skill change: "None Shall Pass!"

Post by Valynn Lionhart on Sat Dec 12, 2009 12:59 am

In Guild Wars, warriors are not designed to be a proper tank or wall very well using only warrior skills. In addition to badly designed skills, aggro almost always avoids the tank for the more squishy of classes, and the tank has almost no recourse for this that is truly effective. The tank has been forced as well to use such gimmicky tactics as obsidian flesh just to survive as a tank. To me that is ridiculous. They should be able to survive solely on warrior skills alone. Being that I have used warrior a lot, and have tanked a lot, I personally believe something needs to be done to make this class more of a tank/defensive protector.

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Re: Submission for another skill change: "None Shall Pass!"

Post by SAL on Sat Dec 12, 2009 1:07 am

The AI seems to actually prioritize targets with the least defense, such as monks. You can see this first hand by building assault spirits with a Ritualist, letting a group of enemies walk into range of them, and see what the spirits choose to target. 90% of the time it's the spellcasters, and most commonly enemy monks get chosen as the first target.

Now this may make sense, in that normally this is how people would act. But it's annoying when enemies are doing this, and the tank(s) really don't always have a lot of effective ways of stopping it. A shout could be considered a taunt, which to me does make sense as an aggro-attracting ability. And realistic or not, I feel like it could potentially make the game more fun if the tanks had more effective ways of directing and controlling aggro throughout the duration of a battle, rather than only at the beginning of it.

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Re: Submission for another skill change: "None Shall Pass!"

Post by Guest on Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:33 am

I have listened to a friend talking for two hours about the aggro management in WoW, and it sounds interesting. In GW, the warriors are never attacked, because they can't show that they are a threat (probably because they aren't).

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Re: Submission for another skill change: "None Shall Pass!"

Post by Guest on Mon Dec 14, 2009 6:15 am

I agree...

Even when playing vs AI, I keep warriors for last... They don't scare me one bit...

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Re: Submission for another skill change: "None Shall Pass!"

Post by SAL on Mon Dec 14, 2009 11:37 pm

papa ultra wrote:I have listened to a friend talking for two hours about the aggro management in WoW, and it sounds interesting. In GW, the warriors are never attacked, because they can't show that they are a threat (probably because they aren't).
I've played WoW myself, and it uses a much simpler aggro system, where there is actually a numerical "threat" value that can be manipulated directly by certain skills. In GW, it seems there is no "threat value" like there is in WoW, at least not a numerical one of any kind. Enemies simply choose a target based on various circumstances. Attacking an enemy can redirect its target to you, for instance. Standing too close to an enemy can redirect its target to you as well. Using certain skills, like storm spells, will cause enemies to lose their target (ie. "break aggro") and become "target neutral", leaving them to choose a new target freely after they "scatter" from the storm.

There's not really any manual way of directly manipulating the aggro in GW like you can in WoW though, which in GW terms would simply mean redirecting an enemy's targeting. And I feel strongly that the Warrior in particular could really benefit from having a way to do exactly that.

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